Do TOPS feel superior to BOTTOMS

[Guest Starbuck]

Remember high school, when the worst thing you could be called was a "faggot." It was the ultimate slur used by str8/jock/cool boys to tell other boys that they were better than them.

 

Fast forward, and here we are: a bunch of mostly gay men hanging out, talking about sex, with other mostly gay men. But have some of us taken on that old str8/jock/cool boy attitude of feeling better than some of the rest of us? Do TOPS (some of them, anyway) feel a sense of superiority to BOTTOMS? Is it part of the psychology of being on top, part of the pleasure and satisfaction of that role?

[bigvalboy]

Starbuck I must say that you are a nice addition to this forum. Interesting thread. I for one am a confirmed top. I have only bottomed twice in my life, and that was when I was in love...but that's a story for Jerry Springer. I do not in anyway feel superior to the bottom, in fact for me, I admire, and worship the bottom. I only wish I was able to bottom. To see a muscle boy bottom, (and you and I have talked about this..) for me is a something to behold. It is what dreams are made of.

 

You do propose a very interesting question however...

[whipped guy]

I have not done the "traditional" bottom thing in quite a while... not my thing... but I did hire a now retired noted NYC Top originally for S&M... and it just sort of happened. He was quite full of himself and said that I looked like a top... and that was troubling to him... he implied that he preferred his tadtitional bottoms to look the part... Of course the dirty little secret was that in his private life the guy was a big time bottom in his personal relationships... so go figure! Some sort of analysis needed to be done there... was it due to guilt ???... but the guy certainly did not look as though he were a bottom by any stretch of the imagination... However, this guy was so full of himself in the way that he presented himself to his clients that I say there was some underlying psychological factors indeed!

 

PS: I also second the motion that Starbuck is a great addition to this forum!!

[Steven_Draker]

 

I find the TOP/BOTTOM dichotomy quite silly. Discussions about who is "better than" and who is "superior" belong in the Kindergarten.

 

I think that some of our self-proclaimed confirmed "TOPS" need to deal with their insecurities first.

[bigvalboy]

Remember high school, when the worst thing you could be called was a "faggot." It was the ultimate slur used by str8/jock/cool boys to tell other boys that they were better than them.

 

Fast forward, and here we are: a bunch of mostly gay men hanging out, talking about sex, with other mostly gay men. But have some of us taken on that old str8/jock/cool boy attitude of feeling better than some of the rest of us? Do TOPS (some of them, anyway) feel a sense of superiority to BOTTOMS? Is it part of the psychology of being on top, part of the pleasure and satisfaction of that role?

 

Sent you a pm....

[Griffin Donavon]

 

I find the TOP/BOTTOM dichotomy quite silly. Discussions about who is "better than" and who is "superior" belong in the Kindergarten.

 

I think that some of our self-proclaimed confirmed "TOPS" need to deal with their insecurities first.

 

Lmao, that picture is perfect..

[Rod Hagen]

O mi god I love The Venture Brothers! Great Gif Steven. Do you watch the show, or is is just something you found?

[Decatur Guy]

I think there's a lot of complex -- and fascinating -- psychology or a mindset that comes along with topping or bottoming.

 

I'm versatile and more bottom-leaning in recent years, but I still like to play on both sides of the fuck. As such, I can't say I feel truly superior or inferior to myself or others. But there is a feeling or emotion akin to that status that I do feel.

 

I'm not a flip-flopper. At any given time if I'm even in the mood for anal, I either want to fuck a guy or be fucked by him but not both. When I am in a top mood and particularly when I am actually topping, I generally feel more aggressive, more assertive, more something that I find hard to put into words. There just isn't quite a word for it -- but there is that feeling of taking something vs. being a bottom, when I feel like I'm giving something. It's something like superiority but yet very different too.

 

When I am topping, I definitely like to direct the action, and I want the bottom guy to be compliant to my fucking. When I am fucking a guy, the last thing in the world on my mind is getting fucked -- particularly by the guy I'm fucking. In his mind, he may interpret all that as my feeling "superior" to him, but that's not what is going on in my head. I WISH there were a word for it!

 

I don't feel inferior when I'm bottoming, but I do feel like there is a certain sense of surrender to it that's akin to inferiority but not definitely not inferiority. I don't feel "less than" the other guy who just fucked me.

 

I know there are guys who insist that topping and bottoming don't equate to domination and submission -- and I get what they are saying. But in my experience and generally speaking, the mere act of penetrating another guy's hole puts you in a dominating position and I definitely feel like I'm in a submissive mode when there's a cock going in and out of my asshole that's choosing its own rhythm and pace and duration.

 

Now I have met 100% tops who definitely came off as feeling superior to me and made it plain during the fuck. And you know what -- I didn't care. Sometimes that translates into a GREAT fuck. And sometimes it doesn't. It all depends on how they pull it off and how excessive that attitude is. A little bit of that attitude while I'm on all fours can be sexy. A lot of it is a turn-off. It all depends on the psychology of both parties involved.

 

To me, the "bottom line" answer in my experience is: Yes, some tops do feel superior to bottoms. But most do not, even if they never give up their own holes.

[jimboivyo]

this is just dumb. top, bottom, who cares. folks spend so much time on 'how' that they forget it should be fun.

 

guys who think bottoming makes you 'weak' are guys I want nothing to do with

[Decatur Guy]

Sigh. I give up.

[jimboivyo]

Fucking' A guys -- seriously -- can we EVER have a discussion about sex on here without people dropping in and talking about how fucking stupid the question is?

 

Half the topic I find interesting in here, folks have to come in and announce the mere premise of the discussion invalid. It's such a gosh darn downer.

 

You haven't been here long enough to know that we all have different points of view? The idea is dumb to me. Asking the question is fine.

 

You got my answer

[Decatur Guy]

You haven't been here long enough to know that we all have different points of view? The idea is dumb to me. Asking the question is fine.

 

You got my answer

 

I've been posting here for years -- in fact, I joined just a few months after you did. I guess I'm just the Invisible Man. In fact, I've been here long enough to have realized the futility of my post after I wrote it and deleted it with a simple "Sigh. I give up" before I realized anyone had seen it. I did that because I realized after I wrote it I was wasting my fucking time.

 

Talk about stupid. THAT was stupid on my part.

[bigvalboy]

Or as the OP suggests, perhaps it is the bottoms that need to get over their insecurities...

[Guest Starbuck]

this is just dumb. top, bottom, who cares. folks spend so much time on 'how' that they forget it should be fun.

 

Dumb? Really? You don't think that the PHYSICAL fun is influenced by the MENTAL/PSYCHOLOGICAL attitudes that each partner brings to the bedroom?

 

And that's just the SEXUAL aspect of things ... when I wrote the original post I was mostly wondering about the SOCIAL aspect; whether some men who identify as TOPS feel a sense of "social superiority" to men who identify as BOTTOMS in a way not entirely unlike the str8/cool/jock kid in high school feeling socially superior to the "faggot."

[bigvalboy]

Dumb? Really? You don't think that the PHYSICAL fun is influenced by the MENTAL/PSYCHOLOGICAL attitudes that each partner brings to the bedroom?

 

And that's just the SEXUAL aspect of things ... when I wrote the original post I was mostly wondering about the SOCiAL aspect; whether some men who identify as TOPS feel a sense of "social superiority" to men who identify as BOTTOMS in a way not entirely unlike the str8/cool/jock kid in high school feeling socially superior to the "faggot."

+1...I saw nothing dumb about what the OP was putting forth here.

[Guest Starbuck]

I think there's a lot of complex -- and fascinating -- psychology or a mindset that comes along with topping or bottoming.

 

+1

 

... and THANK YOU, Decatur Guy, for the rest of your long and thoughtful post. I appreciate your effort in trying to find just the right words for a complexity of psycho-sexual feelings and for the social attitudes that overlap them. It's a subject that fascinates me too.

[docred]

Well here's my 10 cents worth. I really enjoy both ends of the action and for me there doesn't seem to be any difference psychologically. As long as I can look the guy in the eyes, hug and kiss and get the feeling of such an intense connection with him while we're fu**ing then I think that it's such an equal partnership, such an incredible physical bonding of 2 bodies and minds in total ecstasy that the furthest thing from my mind is who is feeling superior.

 

The brain may well be the largest sex organ but my brain has better things to do during sex than worry about feeling superior or inferior. And yes, Starbuck, I realize that you question was far more abstract than my reply, but for me sex is not really a mental exercise LOL

[whipped guy]

Great question and a slight detour aside great answers as well. I really got into Decatur Guy's response as much thought went into it... Actually virtually all the responses have been quite interesting and stimulating as it is always fascinating to see what makes a individual actually tick.

 

Sex should be fun, this place should be fun, and while I totally agree that the brain is the largest and most important sexual organ... it all boils down to having a good time... as that's what it's all ultimately about. So it can be fun to analyze things, but when the fun ultimately begins one simply needs to go with the flow, sit back, (or get into whatever position turns you on) and enjoy the ride... and enjoy to the max no matter what side of the equation you happen to be playing on at any given time!

[bigvalboy]

As long as I can look the guy in the eyes, hug and kiss and get the feeling of such an intense connection with him while we're fu**ing then I think that it's such an equal partnership, such an incredible physical bonding of 2 bodies and minds in total ecstasy that the furthest thing from my mind is who is feeling superior.

 

I agree docred. There is that intensity and connection that is almost hard to describe. Sometimes you feel it, see it, or hear it. When it happens, it is amazing.

[adriano46]

Starbuck I must say that you are a nice addition to this forum. Interesting thread. I for one am a confirmed top. I have only bottomed twice in my life, and that was when I was in love...but that's a story for Jerry Springer. I do not in anyway feel superior to the bottom, in fact for me, I admire, and worship the bottom. I only wish I was able to bottom. To see a muscle boy bottom, (and you and I have talked about this..) for me is a something to behold. It is what dreams are made of.

 

Interesting question and some great responses...

I have never bottomed but I have great respect - awe for bottoms especially for POWER BOTTOMS, my dream. Personally have wondered why it is I cannot loosen up and be a bottom, but it is how I am made I guess... one escort tried to top me (he thought he did... I KNOW he never got really "inside" so go figure... )I do enjoy topping but find I takes too much effort these years (and I am not interested in Viagra or whatever). But I prefer versatile to bottom guys who will like me playing around with their ass. I find them the most attractive types.

[+ purplekow]

Sigh. I give up.

Ah so you are a bottom/

[big-n-tall]

O mi god I love The Venture Brothers! Great Gif Steven. Do you watch the show, or is is just something you found?

 

Slightly off topic but...

 

OMG! Now we have to meet Mr. Hagen! I love the Venture Bros as well. I've meet the creators and got pictures with them.

[Steven_Draker]

I think there's a lot of complex -- and fascinating -- psychology or a mindset that comes along with topping or bottoming.

 

Thoughtful response, Decatur Guy. I think I understand where the complexity of the question (the way it was asked) comes from.

 

As long as I can look the guy in the eyes, hug and kiss and get the feeling of such an intense connection with him while we're fu**ing then I think that it's such an equal partnership, such an incredible physical bonding of 2 bodies and minds in total ecstasy that the furthest thing from my mind is who is feeling superior.

 

Similar to docred I believe that sex is not based on a relationship of power but rather represents an intense connection where two individuals share moments of equal partnership and mutual pleasing.

 

Judging from Starbuck's latest review he's referring to a dominant submissive relationship, hence the confusion with the terms top/bottom.

[Phil_musc]

For me this question is about my own personal evolution as a sexual being. As a young man I had absorbed so much crap about what it is to be a man and what a man does sexually. So much had to do with "taking" one's pleasure from the partner - remember those high school days when guys were talking about who was "putting out?" Who was "loose." For me this translated into what one did with other guys. And certainly I didn't want to seem less than a man (always had issues with that concept of masculinity - hence it took me forever to feel comfortable with the concept of drag, gay guys who were more feminine in behavior, etc. A lot of this had to do with being closeted and afraid of being discovered. I'm pretty much over that now, thank goodness). I used to look in disbelief when people told me that some queenly acting guy was such a great top who absolutely never bottomed. Huh? If I was going to give it up, it certainly wasn't going to happen with some guy who seemed like one of my female relatives. But over the course of a lifetime, my ideas on this evolved - not exactly sure how it happened, but it did. Now I think of sex as not so much an issue of superiority/inferiority/dominance/submission as more of the connection that two people can share, if only for a few fleeting moments. I left that old-school thinking a long time ago and I am glad I did.

[whipped guy]

Similar to docred I believe that sex is not based on a relationship of power but rather represents an intense connection where two individuals share moments of equal partnership and mutual pleasing.

 

Judging from Starbuck's latest review he's referring to a dominant submissive relationship, hence the confusion with the terms top/bottom.

Dom/Sub Top/Bottom... It is ideally all based on an "equality" in the equation. I have mentioned this many times, and I know that Starbuck appreciates the concept, but the Dom and Sub should be on the same wavelength and on the same page. While they appear to be on opposite ends of the spectrum, they are actually two identical components of a balance scale consisting of arms of identical length supporting weights of equal mass. Think the scales of justice.

 

Like everything in life it often involves a bit of compromise, but when perfect equilibrium is achieved the results can be heavenly. Every Dom needs to know how to read his Sub, and the best certainly know how to do that. However, the best of the best seem to know what the Sub needs and wants even before the Sub knows it himself. Still, getting it right the first time or in the first meeting in an escort/client situation is often rare. It can happen, but with familiarity the right balance will be achieved. Unfortunately some Doms/Tops mistakingly think that they need to overly emphasize their "superiority"... That may or may not be what the Sub wants or needs. Adjustments need to be made accordingly... Perhaps the Sub's arm of the balance scale is far to the submissive side. In such a case the long imperious arm of the Dom needs to make its presence known. Conversely, at times the Dom needs to not reach out so far in order to attain that absolute harmony.

 

It all boils down to symmetry... but not nesessary a symmetry of form. Yes, the scale should ideally be balanced, but while one side may be loaded down with lead weights, the other side might just be balancing things out with an overabundance of feathers... as in the old trick question, "What weighs more, a pound of lead or a pound if feathers??"

 

I know I'm thinking too much here, but with all of this in the deep recesses of one's mind can make the actual encounter go quite smoothly... and give one the skills to adjust and read what their partner needs and wants... That's why the best BDSM Doms have had experiences as BDSM Subs. Likewise the best traditional Tops ideally should have experiences as traditional Subs.

 

There is really little difference between Dom/Sub vs. Top/Bottom.