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Shall we start the Debt pool now?


Guy Fawkes
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Shall we start the pool on how much much debt we'll rack up by Febuary 7th? I'm going to say 1.75 trillion.

 

There’s no actual debt ceiling right now

by Alex Pappas

 

There’s no actual debt ceiling right now.

 

The fiscal deal passed by Congress on Wednesday evening to re-open the government and get around the $16.4 trillion limit on borrowing doesn’t actually increase the debt limit. It just temporarily suspends enforcement of it.

 

That means Americans have no idea how much debt their government is going to rack up between now and Feb. 7, when the limits are supposed to go back into place and will have to be raised.

 

http://www.unclaimedmoney.com/news/wp-content/uploads/2012/08/lost-and-missing-money.jpg

"Gun Control means using both hands."

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Got that out of our system now, I hope?

 

The entire premise is disingenuous and intellectually lazy. The debt is a knowable number. Subtract the money coming in from the money congress appropriates and that's the amount of the deficit, which is then added to the public debt. It's simple arithmetic.

 

I say we return the the Gephardt rule: when congress passes an appropriation the debt limit is deemed increased to cover the expenses approved by congress. That rule kept these catfights from happening at all for 20 years.

 

The Gephardt rule was suspended in the 90s when Newt Gingrich became speaker, right before the last time they shut down the government. Yet another thing Republicans have got WRONG WRONG WRONG. :rolleyes:

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Guest countryboywny
Got that out of our system now, I hope?

 

The entire premise is disingenuous and intellectually lazy. The debt is a knowable number. Subtract the money coming in from the money congress appropriates and that's the amount of the deficit, which is then added to the public debt. It's simple arithmetic.

 

I say we return the the Gephardt rule: when congress passes an appropriation the debt limit is deemed increased to cover the expenses approved by congress. That rule kept these catfights from happening at all for 20 years.

 

The Gephardt rule was suspended in the 90s when Newt Gingrich became speaker, right before the last time they shut down the government. Yet another thing Republicans have got WRONG WRONG WRONG. :rolleyes:

 

If I understand this correctly, every time Congress passed an appropriation bill, the debt limit was automatically increased to cover it? If that was true, what was the safe guard to stop Congress from spending us into oblivion?

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If I understand this correctly, every time Congress passed an appropriation bill, the debt limit was automatically increased to cover it? If that was true, what was the safe guard to stop Congress from spending us into oblivion?

 

Presumably, the adults in the room (and the voters) would be the safeguard. That's how the founders intended it to work, anyway.

 

I'm all for robust discussion and negotiation over both necessary and discretionary spending but it should happen before the SPENDING happens, not after the spending is done and the bills come due. And this happens to agree with the constitution which every member of congress took an oath to uphold and defend.

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Guest countryboywny
Presumably, the adults in the room (and the voters) would be the safeguard. That's how the founders intended it to work, anyway.

 

I'm all for robust discussion and negotiation over both necessary and discretionary spending but it should happen before the SPENDING happens, not after the spending is done and the bills come due. And this happens to agree with the constitution which every member of congress took an oath to uphold and defend.

 

Amen to that! :) It seems that the administration and the congress love to let our financial affairs reach a crisis point so that each can play a power game. When that happens, we the taxpayers are the ones that lose. One side note.. did you know that the recently passed CR to fund the government included billions for a dam project in Kentucky? Thank you Mitch McConnell.

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Amen to that! :) It seems that the administration and the congress love to let our financial affairs reach a crisis point so that each can play a power game. When that happens, we the taxpayers are the ones that lose. One side note.. did you know that the recently passed CR to fund the government included billions for a dam project in Kentucky? Thank you Mitch McConnell.

 

Frustrating....and a dam project that already had gone way over budget and was in danger of being shut down, for lack of funding. Stopping the project, then restarting it would have cost more than the billions that they got to keep it going. "And so it goes"

the greatest beauty is

Organic wholeness, the wholeness of life and things,

the divine beauty of the universe.

Love that, not man apart from that,

or else you will share man’s pitiful confusions,

or drown in despair when his days darken."

 

- Robinson Jeffers

 

B e l i e v e

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It seems that the administration and the congress love to

let our financial affairs reach a crisis point so that each can play a power game.

 

Interestingly, both houses of Congress passed budgets back in March. Democrats in both houses have been beggng for Republicans to appoint conferees so it could proceed under "regular order" since then. House democrats actually have it in writing dated last March. It has been blocked by republicans in the senate (lead by Ted Cruz) and in the house (lead by Ted Cruz).

 

One side note.. did you know that the recently passed CR to fund the government included billions for a dam project in Kentucky? Thank you Mitch McConnell.

 

Yeah, and I've seen that he denies knowing it was included. It strains credulity to think that a legislator with his experience, closely involved in hammering out this very agreement, would not know every dot and dash. But, hey, he can always go back home and claim it as a victory during his next election challenge which is probably exactly how it got in there in the first place.

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I can understand if Mitchy McConnell doesn't read every word of a 300 + page bill but likely has his staff read every word and summarize it for him. But last week's bill should have been read completely by every congressman voting on it. As for the dam project, its still amazing how any governmental body wouldn't insist on a firm bid with no outs for unforeseen risks (put that risk in the bid margin) and a performance bond from an insurance company so if the contractor and its engineers really screw up the taxpayers aren't screwed. Instead, probably because of too cozy relationships between the contractor and politicians, the taxpayers just keep paying and paying. If the additional funds for the dam help Mitchy get elected then his party continues to be full of crap about demanding fiscal responsibility.

 

I agree that there shouldn't be a debt limit for one main reason. We've let our poor performing elected employees in DC have the ability to devastate overnight our investments (stocks/bonds/real estate), forever raise the country's interest rate on borrowing and every other rate we'd pay in our personal lives and then there is the cratering of the economy. I'm for a balanced budget amendment that congress cannot override (the last proposal floated allowed congress to override for a few reasons and there should be none). Since balancing in the next 24 or so months would not be good in this economy, how about reducing the gap by 10% per year? And to eventually payoff the debt, amortize the balance into the budget over maybe 20 - 40 years. Any surpluses should be used to repay social security. Social security should have lifetime benefit limits - maybe employer plus employee contributions at 5 - 7 %. Make those limits effective for anyone under a certain age and educate people (starting in high school) about the absolute necessity to save all the time. As well, if someone dies before they've received the aforementioned amount, pay all or a substantial portion to their estate. I don't have an issue with adjusting "entitlements" but that should come after we drop annual defense spending from the $640 or so + billion we spend now (equal to something like the total of the next 25 countries excluding Russia and China). Amazing how the defense department cries like a baby and says we'll be less safe if it has to drop $20 billion in spending. I'll agree with Rand Paul on one thing - defense spending needs a good audit.

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  • 3 weeks later...
  • 5 years later...

"The Debt Limit cannot be raised until Obama spending is contained." -- Donald J. Trump, July 6, 2011

 

Top White House officials are imploring key Republicans to move quickly and raise the debt ceiling, four people briefed on the discussions said, concerned that a prolonged impasse could raise the chances of a misstep that damages the economy later this year.

 

The requests have taken on new urgency because other budget discussions with Capitol Hill have broken down, leaving policymakers at a loss for ways to avoid a pileup of dangerous deadlines in September that could affect the stock market, labor market and economic growth.

 

Wapo 25April19

Whoever would have guessed that a TV reality star with no government experience, 6 bankruptcies, 5 children from 3 different marriages, 11 charges of sexual assault, 4,000+ lawsuits would turn out this bad?

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